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Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family

 
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s_knight8

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Since: Jun 04, 2004
Posts: 476



(Msg. 1) Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2005 2:44 pm
Post subject: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family
Archived from groups: alt>sports>basketball>nba>la-lakers, others (more info?)

http://www.nj.com/sports/ledger/index.ssf?/base/sports-2/111371386859811.xml

The Web site sportsnet.ca

reported that the Carter family received e-mail death threats sent to
Carter's own Web site in the days leading up to the game at Toronto. But
Carter himself didn't know anything about it ("They don't tell me anything,"
he said), and Nets officials said authorities didn't characterize them as
death threats.

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skepticalmale

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Since: Apr 21, 2005
Posts: 4



(Msg. 2) Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:38 am
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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TO "fans" are losers. There is a sick obsession with VC in Toronto. TSN
( Toronto Sports Network ) devotes way to much time promating hatred
towards VC.

They can't accept the fact he no longer wanted to play on a team didn't
want to make the playoffs. VC wants a championship before he retires,
and it's not going to happen in TO. He moved on , the city of TO can't
or won't.

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skepticalmale

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Since: Apr 21, 2005
Posts: 4



(Msg. 3) Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 9:01 am
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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But he's in the playoffs.

In the culture of pro sports that's all that matters.
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Smacdo

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Since: Mar 07, 2005
Posts: 11



(Msg. 4) Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:22 pm
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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<skepticalmale DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1114185682.023537.300160@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> But he's in the playoffs.
>
> In the culture of pro sports that's all that matters.
>

I assume you are responding to me...

I don't think its all that matters. Vince Carter was a demi god in Toronto,
and league wide. Remarkably he has not taken *nearly* the national heat I
thought he would...but in Toronto his name is a swear word. Its just the
wrong thing to do...treating a team and fans like that. Fans pay his
salary. It wasn't the fans that made the team decisions. The fans
worshipped him long after he deserved it. If it wasn't for fans, he would
be just another guy.

Even if he did dog it, why did he have to say it? Who benefits from that?
He deserves what he gets for being stupid enough to do it, and admit to it.

--
"This morning...there's a calm I can't explain" - John Mayer
Thank you 2004 Red Sox
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Granville Waiters' Ghost

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Since: Aug 23, 2004
Posts: 1290



(Msg. 5) Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 5:01 pm
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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In article <2x9ae.2212$K24.776@read1.cgocable.net>,
"Smacdo" <nottoday.TakeThisOut@spamsucks.com> wrote:

> Even if he did dog it, why did he have to say it? Who benefits from that?
> He deserves what he gets for being stupid enough to do it, and admit to it.


I didn't think he did say it. I watched the infamous John
Thompson interview. I had one impression--that all of the
losing and the serious turnover the last few years in
Toronto made it hard to get motivated sometimes--and the
next day, the papers were leading with "VINCE ADMITS HE
DIDN'T TRY."
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Smacdo

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Since: Mar 07, 2005
Posts: 11



(Msg. 6) Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 5:01 pm
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Granville Waiters' Ghost" <x.DeleteThis@x.x> wrote in message
news:x-1353E7.12010322042005@news1.east.earthlink.net...
> In article <2x9ae.2212$K24.776@read1.cgocable.net>,
> "Smacdo" <nottoday.DeleteThis@spamsucks.com> wrote:
>
>> Even if he did dog it, why did he have to say it? Who benefits from
>> that?
>> He deserves what he gets for being stupid enough to do it, and admit to
>> it.
>
>
> I didn't think he did say it. I watched the infamous John
> Thompson interview. I had one impression--that all of the
> losing and the serious turnover the last few years in
> Toronto made it hard to get motivated sometimes--and the
> next day, the papers were leading with "VINCE ADMITS HE
> DIDN'T TRY."

Hmm...I am going to have to check on this...because I am sure I read a quote
somewhere that indicated he didn't try every night...I will get back to you
on this...


--
"This morning...there's a calm I can't explain" - John Mayer
Thank you 2004 Red Sox
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Smacdo

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Since: Mar 07, 2005
Posts: 11



(Msg. 7) Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 5:01 pm
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Smacdo" <nottoday DeleteThis @spamsucks.com> wrote in message
news:CYcae.2246$K24.385@read1.cgocable.net...
>> I didn't think he did say it. I watched the infamous John
>> Thompson interview. I had one impression--that all of the
>> losing and the serious turnover the last few years in
>> Toronto made it hard to get motivated sometimes--and the
>> next day, the papers were leading with "VINCE ADMITS HE
>> DIDN'T TRY."
>
> Hmm...I am going to have to check on this...because I am sure I read a
> quote somewhere that indicated he didn't try every night...I will get back
> to you on this...

I can't find the quote I am thinking of (and it may be a figment of my
imagination) but I will work with what I have to work with...

In that interview, Carter insinuated that he didn't push himself as hard as
he could have. Those words, in and of themselves, are not 100% damning.
However, living in Canada, I have watched a lot of Raptors games in the last
couple of years...and I can say that when you couple his words with the play
on the court night after night...they take on a whole new meaning. He
really should not have admitted that he didn't push himself/get
motivated/try or whatever the phraseology is. He should have dodged that
topic like a landmine because Vince Carter did quit on the Raptors. There
is no other way to describe it. In my mind, what he implied is the same as
if he said 'I quit on the team' because the words, combined with the
actions, make it that way.


--
"This morning...there's a calm I can't explain" - John Mayer
Thank you 2004 Red Sox
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Granville Waiters' Ghost

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Since: Aug 23, 2004
Posts: 1290



(Msg. 8) Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:43 pm
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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In article <Phdae.13675$If1.3673113@read2.cgocable.net>,
"Smacdo" <nottoday DeleteThis @spamsucks.com> wrote:

> I can't find the quote I am thinking of (and it may be a figment of my
> imagination) but I will work with what I have to work with...
>
> In that interview, Carter insinuated that he didn't push himself as hard as
> he could have. Those words, in and of themselves, are not 100% damning.
> However, living in Canada, I have watched a lot of Raptors games in the last
> couple of years...and I can say that when you couple his words with the play
> on the court night after night...they take on a whole new meaning. He
> really should not have admitted that he didn't push himself/get
> motivated/try or whatever the phraseology is. He should have dodged that
> topic like a landmine because Vince Carter did quit on the Raptors. There
> is no other way to describe it. In my mind, what he implied is the same as
> if he said 'I quit on the team' because the words, combined with the
> actions, make it that way.


Okay, well, I don't want to rehash this again. I don't spend much
time thinking about Vince but generally I think he was in a bad
situation and behaved worse.

Here was my post-interview recap in the Raptors group, without
having seen any of the headlines:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?T1FD261FA

This thread was after the headlines came out the next day:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?Z11E621FA

I would only reiterate that it was extremely peculiar that neither
Kenny Smith nor Charles Barkley said anything about his "admission."
What I would think is that Toronto fans believed this (that he was
dogging it) and took this as an oblique confession. Don't know if I
can blame them for it but I think there was a wide gulf between what
he said and how it was interpreted. So we're pretty much in
agreement.
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Isaac

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Since: Feb 10, 2004
Posts: 20



(Msg. 9) Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:43 pm
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 23:43:00 GMT, Granville Waiters' Ghost <x DeleteThis @x.x> wrote:
>
> http://makeashorterlink.com/?Z11E621FA
>
> I would only reiterate that it was extremely peculiar that neither
> Kenny Smith nor Charles Barkley said anything about his "admission."
> What I would think is that Toronto fans believed this (that he was
> dogging it) and took this as an oblique confession. Don't know if I
> can blame them for it but I think there was a wide gulf between what
> he said and how it was interpreted. So we're pretty much in
> agreement.

Maybe Toronto fans read one of Sknight8's subject lines.

Isaac
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skepticalmale

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Since: Apr 21, 2005
Posts: 4



(Msg. 10) Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 10:45 am
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

>> I didn't think he did say it. I watched the infamous John
>> Thompson interview. I had one impression--that all of the
>> losing and the serious turnover the last few years in
>> Toronto made it hard to get motivated sometimes--and the
>> next day, the papers were leading with "VINCE ADMITS HE
>> DIDN'T TRY."

> Hmm...I am going to have to check on this...because I am sure I read
a
> quote somewhere that indicated he didn't try every night...I will get
back
> to you on this...



I can't find the quote I am thinking of (and it may be a figment of my
imagination) but I will work with what I have to work with...

Vince tried to clear this up yesterday with Ahmad Rashad, don't think
he did well enough to convince Toronto fans though.
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skepticalmale

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Since: Apr 21, 2005
Posts: 4



(Msg. 11) Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 10:47 am
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

> But he's in the playoffs.

> In the culture of pro sports that's all that matters.



I assume you are responding to me...

I don't think its all that matters. Vince Carter was a demi god in
Toronto,
and league wide. Remarkably he has not taken *nearly* the national
heat I
thought he would...but in Toronto his name is a swear word. Its just
the
wrong thing to do...treating a team and fans like that. Fans pay his
salary. It wasn't the fans that made the team decisions. The fans
worshipped him long after he deserved it. If it wasn't for fans, he
would
be just another guy.


Your assuming that the goings on in TO really matter to the rest of the
country.
I see more Cleveland and Philly jersey, then Raptors in my part of the
country.
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Leaping Larry Jojo

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Since: Apr 26, 2005
Posts: 1



(Msg. 12) Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:12 am
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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skepticalmale RemoveThis @hotmail.com wrote in message news:<1114451274.726744.196530 RemoveThis @o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>...
> > But he's in the playoffs.
>
> > In the culture of pro sports that's all that matters.
>
>
>
> I assume you are responding to me...
>
> I don't think its all that matters. Vince Carter was a demi god in
> Toronto,
> and league wide. Remarkably he has not taken *nearly* the national
> heat I
> thought he would...but in Toronto his name is a swear word. Its just
> the
> wrong thing to do...treating a team and fans like that. Fans pay his
> salary. It wasn't the fans that made the team decisions. The fans
> worshipped him long after he deserved it. If it wasn't for fans, he
> would
> be just another guy.
>
>
> Your assuming that the goings on in TO really matter to the rest of the
> country.
> I see more Cleveland and Philly jersey, then Raptors in my part of the
> country.


I'd just like to note, Vince's popularity was not very good after he
went down with the *legit* injury in 2002. He had been getting booed
fairly consistently ever since. Some of it was justified, some of it
was questionable (such as when Vince cut down on some of the dunking
when he came back prematurely, and played gimpy)

He certainly behaved poorly (at least in his on the court play) in his
last few months here, but as a Raptor fan I can't say that the fans
"worshipped" him long after he deserved it. The desire to drive Vince
out of Toronto came quite a bit before he started "dogging it"
(depending on where you start nailing down the exact point he did).
You could see the writing on the wall when Bosh first scored 20+
points. The media was already ready to have a new "man".
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StarLite

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Since: May 02, 2005
Posts: 2



(Msg. 13) Posted: Mon May 02, 2005 12:52 am
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>sports>basketball>nba>nj-nets (more info?)

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 17:01:50 GMT, Granville Waiters' Ghost <x RemoveThis @x.x>
wrote:

>In article <2x9ae.2212$K24.776@read1.cgocable.net>,
> "Smacdo" <nottoday RemoveThis @spamsucks.com> wrote:
>
>> Even if he did dog it, why did he have to say it? Who benefits from that?
>> He deserves what he gets for being stupid enough to do it, and admit to it.
>
>
>I didn't think he did say it. I watched the infamous John
>Thompson interview. I had one impression--that all of the
>losing and the serious turnover the last few years in
>Toronto made it hard to get motivated sometimes--and the
>next day, the papers were leading with "VINCE ADMITS HE
>DIDN'T TRY."


Vince was directly involved in signing most of the players that
where the down full of the Raptors team, he was consulted in most
of the signings. So the guy is pure EVIL and come on has
mother still runs has life. he the N.B.A's Urkel.
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StarLite

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Since: May 02, 2005
Posts: 2



(Msg. 14) Posted: Mon May 02, 2005 1:01 am
Post subject: Re: Raptor fans send death threats to Vince's family [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 17:01:50 GMT, Granville Waiters' Ghost <x RemoveThis @x.x>
wrote:

>In article <2x9ae.2212$K24.776@read1.cgocable.net>,
> "Smacdo" <nottoday RemoveThis @spamsucks.com> wrote:
>
>> Even if he did dog it, why did he have to say it? Who benefits from that?
>> He deserves what he gets for being stupid enough to do it, and admit to it.
>
>
>I didn't think he did say it. I watched the infamous John
>Thompson interview. I had one impression--that all of the
>losing and the serious turnover the last few years in
>Toronto made it hard to get motivated sometimes--and the
>next day, the papers were leading with "VINCE ADMITS HE
>DIDN'T TRY."


Away from all the noise and all the anger, what is left is a most
debilitating lesson for the Toronto Raptors. A setback they can never
let happen again.

The Vince Carter example won't go away -- we can't let it go away --
no matter how many signs are printed and how much screaming is heard.

Not if the Raptors are to gain anything from this pathetic experience
other than a couple of measly draft picks who turn out no better than
Rafael Araujo.

This was a mess made by ownership, directed by the board of Maple Leaf
Sports and Entertainment Ltd., enabled by the general manager of his
time, Glen Grunwald, and created by a cozy atmosphere that chairman
Larry Tanenbaum truly believed in. Thinking he was doing the right
thing. Hitching his franchise to a flawed star, misunderstanding that
the real world and sport have so little in common.

The trouble is, the people who run MLSEL still have difficulty
distinguishing between their successful day jobs, their business world
and a culture they seem unable to understand.

The fingerprints of blame pointed solely at Carter last night --
booing him all the way to a 39-point night and another Raptors defeat
-- but at least for one night, the Toronto fan had something to care
about.

The fact this Raptors franchise is in shambles again, the fact it
takes the most despised athlete in Toronto history to get this crowd
to care, is somewhat sobering on its own.

The hope is that MLSEL will learn from this: That is the only hope.
But there is nothing tangible that leads one to believe the culture of
pampering athletes and expecting little from them is about to change.

All you have to do is go back to Aug. 3, 2001 to try and understand.
That wasn't just a $93-million US day for Vince Carter, it was the day
Tanenbaum truly became an NBA owner. Not a sporting winner, just an
owner of some repute.

He had spent so much of that summer trying to convince Carter this was
the place to be, this was his team, his future, his home. Of all the
deals Tanenbaum had been part of in his life, this one was different.
This one felt like no other. That he was making a difference.

He had no idea it would turn out like this. He had no idea that when
he rewarded Carter with a lifetime of riches, he all but made him a
part of ownership. From that August day on, Carter wasn't just a
player. He was part GM, part board member. He flew in private jets. He
went to dinner with the owners. He was their friend, someone they
could show off.

The very toy that wound up blowing up in their faces.

They gave Carter the franchise keys to their car and he drove the team
over a cliff. All by himself. He got his money and stopped running. He
played only when he felt like playing. He needed to be consulted on
everything from team meals to draft picks to trade talks.

It became all Vince all the time until he got tired and bored and
disinterested. Which happened to coincide with a change in direction.
Suddenly, the Raptors had changed the rules on him. Suddenly, they had
hired a general manager who wasn't his choice.

It was really no different than trying to discipline a child. After
letting the infant get away with everything, they started saying no.
The infant cried and typically rebelled.

The rest is unfortunate history. A history the Raptors can't afford to
repeat -- not with this Carter mess getting worse by the moment.
Carter scored a million points last night, the Raptors lost, the fans
ran out of boos, Eric Williams and Aaron Williams didn't play and
Alonzo Mourning was scoring points for Miami.

There are three games to play. This season can't end soon enough.


http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Columnists/Simmons/2005/04/16/1000041-sun.html
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