Roberson?

this is awesome news. we are going to dominate the league now.
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

On Jul 24, 8:51 pm, Dan Gaters <dan.gat... RemoveThis @earthlink.net> wrote:
> Capn'O:
>
> > we are going to dominate the league now.
>
> We already dominate the league. Just not in basketball.
>
> DG

Ask Isiah. Poised to make a deep run in the playoffs in 09...
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

Capn'O:

> we are going to dominate the league now.

We already dominate the league. Just not in basketball.

DG
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

Frank Rizzo:

> Ask Isiah. Poised to make a deep run in the playoffs in 09...

Seriously, do we not have the best ratio of profits to suckage in all
professional sports?

I'd love to know if that ratio went up or down in the past 5 years. If up,
who do we thank?

DG
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

Dan Gaters wrote:
> Frank Rizzo:
>
>> Ask Isiah. Poised to make a deep run in the playoffs in 09...
>
> Seriously, do we not have the best ratio of profits to suckage in all
> professional sports?

Not sure on profits....
I would guess Sterling and the clippers have had that wrapped up for
generations...

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/32/biz_07nba_NBA-Team-Valuations_Income.html

these are for season before last

Wins-to-player cost ratio- Compares the number of wins per player payroll
relative to the rest of the NBA. Postseason wins count twice as much as
regular season wins. A score of 120 means that the team achieved 20% more
victories per dollar of payroll compared with the league average.

Knicks
Wins-to-player cost ratio 40

Operating Inc. $-42.2 mil

The Knicks payroll topped $100 million last year for a third straight
season. Their $45 million luxury tax bill was $38 million higher than
Dallas, the second highest spending club. Knick fans were rewarded with 33
wins and 49 losses, seven games out of the last playoff spot in the weak
Eastern Conference and the same record as the Charlotte Bobcats, who spent
$42 million on players.
Average Ticket Price: $71

Clips
Wins-to-player cost ratio 92
Operating Inc. $9.8 mil
The Paper Clips took a step back last season by missing the playoffs after
completing their best year since 1975 the prior year. But the Clippers are
no longer the doormat they were through the 1980s and 1990s. Owner Donald
Sterling finally opened up his checkbook and signed talented players like
Elton Brand and Corey Maggette to long-term contracts. The team's fortunes
took a hit when Brand ruptured his achilles tendon likely knocking him out
for the year. The team's improved play in recent years has allowed them to
bump up ticket prices. Good thing as the team is strictly a tenant in the
AEG-owned Staples Center and gets limited revenue from premium seating and
sponsorships.
Average Ticket Price: $54

Other end of the spectrum
Spurs
Wins-to-player cost ratio 188
Operating Inc. $15.5 mil
The small-market Spurs are one of the NBA's most valuable franchises thanks
to consistently superb performance on the hardwood and a rabid fan base that
packs the AT&T Center and lets the team maximize sponsorship revenue.
Average Ticket Price: $46

Most profitable
Bulls
Wins-to-player cost ratio 151
Operating Inc. $59.3 mil
Not only have the Chicago Bulls survived the departure of Michael Jordan,
but they have thrived since the superstar retired (financially at least).
The Bulls have been the NBA's most profitable team this decade thanks to a
huge fan base and low payrolls. The team has averaged $46 million in
operating profits the past eight seasons versus a league average of $7
million. Only the Lakers have been in the same stratosphere when it comes to
profits.
Owner Jerry Reinsdorf will have to open up his checkbook to keep his young
stars, like Ben Gordon and Luol Deng, who are due big raises.
Average Ticket Price: $56
==========
Or not....
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

On Jul 24, 11:39 pm, Dan Gaters <dan.gat... RemoveThis @earthlink.net> wrote:
> Frank Rizzo:
>
> > Ask Isiah. Poised to make a deep run in the playoffs in 09...
>
> Seriously, do we not have the best ratio of profits to suckage in all
> professional sports?

Certainly salary/performance. I don't know how profitable they are.
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

On Jul 25, 8:14 am, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM....RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Dan Gaters wrote:
> > Frank Rizzo:
>
> >> Ask Isiah. Poised to make a deep run in the playoffs in 09...
>
> > Seriously, do we not have the best ratio of profits to suckage in all
> > professional sports?
>
> Not sure on profits....
> I would guess Sterling and the clippers have had that wrapped up for
> generations...
>
> http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/32/biz_07nba_NBA-Team-Valuations_Inc...
>
> these are for season before last
>
> Wins-to-player cost ratio- Compares the number of wins per player payroll
> relative to the rest of the NBA. Postseason wins count twice as much as
> regular season wins. A score of 120 means that the team achieved 20% more
> victories per dollar of payroll compared with the league average.
>
> Knicks
> Wins-to-player cost ratio 40
>
> Operating Inc. $-42.2 mil
>
> The Knicks payroll topped $100 million last year for a third straight
> season. Their $45 million luxury tax bill was $38 million higher than
> Dallas, the second highest spending club. Knick fans were rewarded with 33
> wins and 49 losses, seven games out of the last playoff spot in the weak
> Eastern Conference and the same record as the Charlotte Bobcats, who spent
> $42 million on players.
> Average Ticket Price: $71
>
> Clips
> Wins-to-player cost ratio 92
> Operating Inc. $9.8 mil
> The Paper Clips took a step back last season by missing the playoffs after
> completing their best year since 1975 the prior year. But the Clippers are
> no longer the doormat they were through the 1980s and 1990s. Owner Donald
> Sterling finally opened up his checkbook and signed talented players like
> Elton Brand and Corey Maggette to long-term contracts. The team's fortunes
> took a hit when Brand ruptured his achilles tendon likely knocking him out
> for the year. The team's improved play in recent years has allowed them to
> bump up ticket prices. Good thing as the team is strictly a tenant in the
> AEG-owned Staples Center and gets limited revenue from premium seating and
> sponsorships.
> Average Ticket Price: $54
>
> Other end of the spectrum
> Spurs
> Wins-to-player cost ratio 188
> Operating Inc. $15.5 mil
> The small-market Spurs are one of the NBA's most valuable franchises thanks
> to consistently superb performance on the hardwood and a rabid fan base that
> packs the AT&T Center and lets the team maximize sponsorship revenue.
> Average Ticket Price: $46
>
> Most profitable
> Bulls
> Wins-to-player cost ratio 151
> Operating Inc. $59.3 mil
> Not only have the Chicago Bulls survived the departure of Michael Jordan,
> but they have thrived since the superstar retired (financially at least).
> The Bulls have been the NBA's most profitable team this decade thanks to a
> huge fan base and low payrolls. The team has averaged $46 million in
> operating profits the past eight seasons versus a league average of $7
> million. Only the Lakers have been in the same stratosphere when it comes to
> profits.
> Owner Jerry Reinsdorf will have to open up his checkbook to keep his young
> stars, like Ben Gordon and Luol Deng, who are due big raises.
> Average Ticket Price: $56
> ==========
> Or not....

Only Laurel could dig this up.
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

Frank Rizzo wrote:
> On Jul 25, 8:14 am, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM....DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Dan Gaters wrote:
>>> Frank Rizzo:
>>
>>>> Ask Isiah. Poised to make a deep run in the playoffs in 09...
>>
>>> Seriously, do we not have the best ratio of profits to suckage in
>>> all professional sports?
>>
>> Not sure on profits....
>> I would guess Sterling and the clippers have had that wrapped up for
>> generations...
>>
>> http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/32/biz_07nba_NBA-Team-Valuations_Inc...
>>
>> these are for season before last
>>
>> Wins-to-player cost ratio- Compares the number of wins per player
>> payroll relative to the rest of the NBA. Postseason wins count twice
>> as much as regular season wins. A score of 120 means that the team
>> achieved 20% more victories per dollar of payroll compared with the
>> league average.
>>
>> Knicks
>> Wins-to-player cost ratio 40
>>
>> Operating Inc. $-42.2 mil
>>
>> The Knicks payroll topped $100 million last year for a third straight
>> season. Their $45 million luxury tax bill was $38 million higher than
>> Dallas, the second highest spending club. Knick fans were rewarded
>> with 33 wins and 49 losses, seven games out of the last playoff spot
>> in the weak Eastern Conference and the same record as the Charlotte
>> Bobcats, who spent $42 million on players.
>> Average Ticket Price: $71
>>
>> Clips
>> Wins-to-player cost ratio 92
>> Operating Inc. $9.8 mil
>> The Paper Clips took a step back last season by missing the playoffs
>> after completing their best year since 1975 the prior year. But the
>> Clippers are no longer the doormat they were through the 1980s and
>> 1990s. Owner Donald Sterling finally opened up his checkbook and
>> signed talented players like Elton Brand and Corey Maggette to
>> long-term contracts. The team's fortunes took a hit when Brand
>> ruptured his achilles tendon likely knocking him out for the year.
>> The team's improved play in recent years has allowed them to bump up
>> ticket prices. Good thing as the team is strictly a tenant in the
>> AEG-owned Staples Center and gets limited revenue from premium
>> seating and sponsorships.
>> Average Ticket Price: $54
>>
>> Other end of the spectrum
>> Spurs
>> Wins-to-player cost ratio 188
>> Operating Inc. $15.5 mil
>> The small-market Spurs are one of the NBA's most valuable franchises
>> thanks to consistently superb performance on the hardwood and a
>> rabid fan base that packs the AT&T Center and lets the team maximize
>> sponsorship revenue. Average Ticket Price: $46
>>
>> Most profitable
>> Bulls
>> Wins-to-player cost ratio 151
>> Operating Inc. $59.3 mil
>> Not only have the Chicago Bulls survived the departure of Michael
>> Jordan, but they have thrived since the superstar retired
>> (financially at least). The Bulls have been the NBA's most
>> profitable team this decade thanks to a huge fan base and low
>> payrolls. The team has averaged $46 million in operating profits the
>> past eight seasons versus a league average of $7 million. Only the
>> Lakers have been in the same stratosphere when it comes to profits.
>> Owner Jerry Reinsdorf will have to open up his checkbook to keep his
>> young stars, like Ben Gordon and Luol Deng, who are due big raises.
>> Average Ticket Price: $56
>> ==========
>> Or not....
>
> Only Laurel could dig this up.

Sure forbes.com is just so obscure a source for franchise evaluations....
=)


GSWs
Wins-to-player cost ratio 109
Operating Inc. $1.3 mil

In the playoffs the Warriors shocked the top-seeded Dallas Mavericks
(Nellie's old team) in one of the biggest upsets in NBA history. The playoff
run sparked the sale of 5,000 new season tickets and enabled the team to
lease all 64 season suites.


When discussing signings we blow off a mil or two diference...Ws best year
lately the margin was just over 1 million. No wonder they fight to stay out
of the tax this summer.
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

On Jul 25, 6:44 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM....TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Frank Rizzo wrote:
> > On Jul 25, 8:14 am, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM....TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> Dan Gaters wrote:
> >>> Frank Rizzo:
>
> >>>> Ask Isiah. Poised to make a deep run in the playoffs in 09...
>
> >>> Seriously, do we not have the best ratio of profits to suckage in
> >>> all professional sports?
>
> >> Not sure on profits....
> >> I would guess Sterling and the clippers have had that wrapped up for
> >> generations...
>
> >>http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/32/biz_07nba_NBA-Team-Valuations_Inc...
>
> >> these are for season before last
>
> >> Wins-to-player cost ratio- Compares the number of wins per player
> >> payroll relative to the rest of the NBA. Postseason wins count twice
> >> as much as regular season wins. A score of 120 means that the team
> >> achieved 20% more victories per dollar of payroll compared with the
> >> league average.
>
> >> Knicks
> >> Wins-to-player cost ratio 40
>
> >> Operating Inc. $-42.2 mil
>
> >> The Knicks payroll topped $100 million last year for a third straight
> >> season. Their $45 million luxury tax bill was $38 million higher than
> >> Dallas, the second highest spending club. Knick fans were rewarded
> >> with 33 wins and 49 losses, seven games out of the last playoff spot
> >> in the weak Eastern Conference and the same record as the Charlotte
> >> Bobcats, who spent $42 million on players.
> >> Average Ticket Price: $71
>
> >> Clips
> >> Wins-to-player cost ratio 92
> >> Operating Inc. $9.8 mil
> >> The Paper Clips took a step back last season by missing the playoffs
> >> after completing their best year since 1975 the prior year. But the
> >> Clippers are no longer the doormat they were through the 1980s and
> >> 1990s. Owner Donald Sterling finally opened up his checkbook and
> >> signed talented players like Elton Brand and Corey Maggette to
> >> long-term contracts. The team's fortunes took a hit when Brand
> >> ruptured his achilles tendon likely knocking him out for the year.
> >> The team's improved play in recent years has allowed them to bump up
> >> ticket prices. Good thing as the team is strictly a tenant in the
> >> AEG-owned Staples Center and gets limited revenue from premium
> >> seating and sponsorships.
> >> Average Ticket Price: $54
>
> >> Other end of the spectrum
> >> Spurs
> >> Wins-to-player cost ratio 188
> >> Operating Inc. $15.5 mil
> >> The small-market Spurs are one of the NBA's most valuable franchises
> >> thanks to consistently superb performance on the hardwood and a
> >> rabid fan base that packs the AT&T Center and lets the team maximize
> >> sponsorship revenue. Average Ticket Price: $46
>
> >> Most profitable
> >> Bulls
> >> Wins-to-player cost ratio 151
> >> Operating Inc. $59.3 mil
> >> Not only have the Chicago Bulls survived the departure of Michael
> >> Jordan, but they have thrived since the superstar retired
> >> (financially at least). The Bulls have been the NBA's most
> >> profitable team this decade thanks to a huge fan base and low
> >> payrolls. The team has averaged $46 million in operating profits the
> >> past eight seasons versus a league average of $7 million. Only the
> >> Lakers have been in the same stratosphere when it comes to profits.
> >> Owner Jerry Reinsdorf will have to open up his checkbook to keep his
> >> young stars, like Ben Gordon and Luol Deng, who are due big raises.
> >> Average Ticket Price: $56
> >> ==========
> >> Or not....
>
> > Only Laurel could dig this up.
>
> Sure forbes.com is just so obscure a source for franchise evaluations....
> =)
>
> GSWs
> Wins-to-player cost ratio 109
> Operating Inc. $1.3 mil
>
> In the playoffs the Warriors shocked the top-seeded Dallas Mavericks
> (Nellie's old team) in one of the biggest upsets in NBA history. The playoff
> run sparked the sale of 5,000 new season tickets and enabled the team to
> lease all 64 season suites.
>
> When discussing signings we blow off a mil or two diference...Ws best year
> lately the margin was just over 1 million. No wonder they fight to stay out
> of the tax this summer.

If Larry Ellison (who really wants the team) was the owner instead of
Chris Cohan, there would be no skimping. That dude is in Paul Allen
territory financially and has a habit of buying what he wants when he
wants it (PeopleSoft, America's Cup Berth etc). He's made offers to
Cohan but Cohan won't sell.

That said, Mullin is NOW a big believer in flexibility so he can make
trades if he needs to, like the Marcus Williams trade (which was
needed)..

Rizzo
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

Frank Rizzo:

> That dude is in Paul Allen territory financially

Ellison is much richer than Allen: Larry #15, Paul #43

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_100_wealthiest_people#Top_billionai
res

How do we assess the Paul Allen ownership years then?

DG
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

Dan Gaters wrote:
> Frank Rizzo:
>
>> That dude is in Paul Allen territory financially
>
> Ellison is much richer than Allen: Larry #15, Paul #43
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_100_wealthiest_people#Top_billionai
> res
>
> How do we assess the Paul Allen ownership years then?


Hard lessons learned about throwing money at it.... get the right brains
instead.

Next year (depending on one of his own remaining mistakes) they will be 15
or 24 million under the cap besides the team they have built though the
draft and trades.
In 2 or 3 years he will be paying luxury tax again, but it will be on
unselfish allstars and a good team.

It is still great to have him just be able to write 3 million checks to buy
extra draft picks...and know he will pay again to keep the team together


--
Laurel T
"Superstar- A player who hears what he
doesn't want to hear, sees what he doesn't
want to see, and does what he doesn't want to do"
-Unknown
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

On Jul 26, 10:27 am, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM....DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Dan Gaters wrote:
> > Frank Rizzo:
>
> >> That dude is in Paul Allen territory financially
>
> > Ellison is much richer than Allen: Larry #15, Paul #43
>
> >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_100_wealthiest_people#Top_bi...
> > res
>
> > How do we assess the Paul Allen ownership years then?
>
> Hard lessons learned about throwing  money at it.... get the right brains
> instead.

...

> It is still great to have him just be able to write 3 million checks to buy
> extra draft picks...and know he will pay again to keep the team together

We are hoping against hope that Dolan has learned the same lesson.
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson? 

On Jul 26, 7:27 am, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM... RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
> Dan Gaters wrote:
> > Frank Rizzo:
>
> >> That dude is in Paul Allen territory financially
>
> > Ellison is much richer than Allen: Larry #15, Paul #43
>
> >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_100_wealthiest_people#Top_bi...
> > res
>
> > How do we assess the Paul Allen ownership years then?
>
> Hard lessons learned about throwing money at it.... get the right brains
> instead.
>
Oh I agree. Just saying when it DOES come time to pull the trigger on
a franchise player an owner like Cohan flinches, where Allen (and
Ellison) wouldn't flinch. That can make the difference between a
franchise player leaving or staying.

Rizzo
 >> Stay informed about: Roberson?