Sonics to OKC? Seriously?

On May 1, 6:50 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM....DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> > years.
>
> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San Antonio.
> And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.

Cept that Portland's metro population is twice the size of OKC
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

On May 1, 9:04 pm, " bozak" <________boz....DeleteThis@gmail.com________>
wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM....DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in messagenews:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
> > Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
> >> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city.
>
> > So going from a city of 3 mil to a smaller market of  here is a plus
>
> >> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>
> >> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2
> >> million.
>
> > But here is a minus? =)
>
> >> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> >> years.
>
> > Why? Same size and only pro sports team  as Portland, SLC and San Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will
> > be a state wide market.
>
> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

yeahhh, wichita!!
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
> Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
>> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city.
>
> So going from a city of 3 mil to a smaller market of here is a plus
>
>
>> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>>
>> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2
>> million.
>
> But here is a minus? =)
>
>
>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>> years.
>
> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will
> be a state wide market.

not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

bozak wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message


>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...

NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those markets.


--
Laurel T
Frank Layden on a 60-foot Maurice Lucas shot that
sent a game into overtime:
"In most places he would have won a car
or a trip to Hawaii. All he got was a tie."
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

" bozak" <________bozak1 RemoveThis @gmail.com________> wrote in message
news:fFuSj.8192$zw6.6349@trnddc06...
>
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>> Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
>>> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city.
>>
>> So going from a city of 3 mil to a smaller market of here is a plus
>>
>>
>>> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>>>
>>> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2
>>> million.
>>
>> But here is a minus? =)
>>
>>
>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>>> years.
>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...

Northwest Arkansas too (about a half million people), even Little Rock area
(almost a million people) and KC (2 million) if you *really* push it...

brink
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...

>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>> years.
>
> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San Antonio.
> And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.

San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2 million
people.. plus tons of college students.

Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't think
Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.

SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million people...
That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to the north). Also,
SLC, according to Forbes, is the fastest growing business city in the
country right now... which means patrons.

Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the Oklahoma
City area which has 1.2 million citizens...

Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on basketball
games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner think OKC can
afford to build them a shiney new arena that can compete with other NBA
teams?

I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>
>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in
>>> 5 years.
>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
> regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2
> million people.. plus tons of college students.

It was the smallest market in the league for a long time and suceeded. And
Texas has two other teams.

>
> Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't
> think Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.

Have to stretch it to Salem...

>
> SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million
> people...

SLC area is 1.2 mil.

>That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to
> the north).

The Wasatch front inluding those towns 40 miles to each is 1.8 mil.
http://www.saltlakecityutah.org/aboutsaltlake.htm

The entire state is 2.7 mil... OK has 3.7


>
> Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on
> basketball games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner
> think OKC can afford to build them a shiney new arena that can
> compete with other NBA teams?
>

They have an arena and tax support passed by a wide margin to upgrade it.
They had good attendence for the Hornets and the NBA does not approve a move
unless they have a good percentage of season tickets committed.

> I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

Other teams will become available. OKC already had a test drive.


--
Laurel T
When rats leave a sinking ship,
where exactly do they think they're going?"
- Douglas Gauck
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

"Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exists1.DeleteThis@Earth71.net> wrote in message
news:MOuSj.8194$zw6.7314@trnddc06...
>
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>
>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>>> years.
>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
> regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2
> million people.. plus tons of college students.
>
> Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't
> think Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.
>
> SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million
> people... That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to the
> north). Also, SLC, according to Forbes, is the fastest growing business
> city in the country right now... which means patrons.
>
> Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the Oklahoma
> City area which has 1.2 million citizens...
> Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on
> basketball games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner think
> OKC can afford to build them a shiney new arena that can compete with
> other NBA teams?

They already have a new arena!

>
> I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

Why? No facility in place, there doesn't seem to be a great demand for
it...

Look, I'm not arguing that OKC is a *great* place for a team (it really
isn't and it could very well be a Memphis or New Orleans redux)... just
that it's more complicated than "find the biggest metro area unserved by NBA
basketball"...

If *that* were the formula, the NFL would have had a team in LA 10 years
ago!

brink
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message news:67vbirF2r4p6fU1@mid.individual.net...
> bozak wrote:
>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
>
>>>
>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>
>> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
>
> NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those markets.

i wasnt talking about tv rights... im talking about the arena is within a
close enough distance for fans of those cities to identify with... which also
brings forth sales of plenty team merchandise and an occasional game every
now and then...
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

bozak wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vbirF2r4p6fU1@mid.individual.net...
>> bozak wrote:
>>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>>
>>>>
>>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>>
>>> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
>>
>> NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those
>> markets.
>
> i wasnt talking about tv rights... im talking about the arena is
> within a close enough distance for fans of those cities to identify
> with...
> which also brings forth sales of plenty team merchandise and an occasional
> game
> every now and then...

That works....
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

" bozak" <________bozak1.TakeThisOut@gmail.com________> wrote in message
news:bWuSj.8196$zw6.5828@trnddc06...
>
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vbirF2r4p6fU1@mid.individual.net...
>> bozak wrote:
>>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>>
>>>>
>>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>>
>>> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
>>
>> NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those markets.
>
> i wasnt talking about tv rights... im talking about the arena is within a
> close enough distance for fans of those cities to identify with... which
> also
> brings forth sales of plenty team merchandise and an occasional game every
> now and then...

Springfield, Missouri is 300 miles from Oklahoma City... Springfield is an
equal distance from St Louis.

Amarillo, Texas is 260 miles from Oklahoma City...

Wichita is 160 miles...

Count maybe 10 people at most who would travel that far to see a team that
they were unfamiliar with.... or yet alone who could afford the occasional
drive and good enough tickets (worth it) to see the team play. People from
two cities would have to stay over night, and the third city would be a 2
and half to 3 hour trip back home.

By those standards... Oklahoma Cities population could just as well drive to
Dallas and watch the Mavs play. Just does not work that way.
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

"Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exists1 DeleteThis @Earth71.net> wrote in message
news:N0wSj.9629$PY5.1385@trnddc01...
>
> " bozak" <________bozak1 DeleteThis @gmail.com________> wrote in message
> news:bWuSj.8196$zw6.5828@trnddc06...
>>
>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:67vbirF2r4p6fU1@mid.individual.net...
>>> bozak wrote:
>>>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>>>
>>>> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
>>>
>>> NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those markets.
>>
>> i wasnt talking about tv rights... im talking about the arena is within a
>> close enough distance for fans of those cities to identify with... which
>> also
>> brings forth sales of plenty team merchandise and an occasional game
>> every
>> now and then...
>
> Springfield, Missouri is 300 miles from Oklahoma City... Springfield is an
> equal distance from St Louis.
>
> Amarillo, Texas is 260 miles from Oklahoma City...
>
> Wichita is 160 miles...
>
> Count maybe 10 people at most who would travel that far to see a team that
> they were unfamiliar with.... or yet alone who could afford the occasional
> drive and good enough tickets (worth it) to see the team play. People from
> two cities would have to stay over night, and the third city would be a 2
> and half to 3 hour trip back home.
>
> By those standards... Oklahoma Cities population could just as well drive
> to Dallas and watch the Mavs play. Just does not work that way.

Sure it does and it's not necessarily about getting those people into the
arena (though I'm sure they'll have their share of out-of-town bball fans at
each game)... it's about getting the people in a bigger region to support
the team through TV, merch, internet, etc... all of which of course means
more money for the team.

OKC would be the closest team for all those markets listed above plus KC and
NW Arkansas... the trick is to figure out how to market the team in those
areas... baseball often does a good job of this by placing affiliated minor
league teams in markets... the Chicago Cubs have their AAA affiliate in Des
Moines which is a big reason why most of Iowa is considered "Cubs Country"
rather than "Twins Country."

The Lakers have done similar things by playing exhibition games in
Bakersfield, San Diego, and Las Vegas... they claim "ownership" of those
out-of-town markets by building an actual presence there.

Let's see if the OKC management is sharp enough to pull something like that
off...

brink
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously? 

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:67vhf4F2q6fhsU2@mid.individual.net...
> It was the smallest market in the league for a long time and suceeded. And
> Texas has two other teams.

Sure... back when the ABA existed and when basketball games were affordable
and where small time business men could invest in them.


> They have an arena and tax support passed by a wide margin to upgrade it.
> They had good attendence for the Hornets and the NBA does not approve a
> move unless they have a good percentage of season tickets committed.

Yeah, but the Hornets thing could have been a flash in the pan. I mean, its
worth a try, but expect an owner to be looking for an arena deal. Owners can
make huge profits with a city that is willing to pay for a 300+ million
dollar arena... The Ford center cost 89 million...The owner may very well
just be using OKC as a layover... It's possible. I still guess 5 years.. but
I don't mind if it works... I mean.. I would be one of the few who would
actually drive to OKC to see the Mavs play there, but only because I know
some people there and would have free places to stay.
 >> Stay informed about: Sonics to OKC? Seriously?